Shownotes:
Get ready to turn the volume up as Todd Whitaker delves into the heart of what transforms good into great, in classrooms and beyond! In this episode, I'm taking you on a behind-the-scenes tour of personal growth where the power of positivity meets practical wisdom. Expect to come away with a fresh perspective on how gratitude shapes our journey and why every step we take towards betterment is a reason to be thankful. This is your invitation to be inspired, to reflect, and to embrace the joy of making a difference. Let's get started!
About Our Guest:
Todd Whitaker has been fortunate to be able to blend his passion with his career. Recognized as a leading presenter in the field of education, his message about the importance of teaching has resonated with hundreds of thousands of educators around the world. Todd is a professor of educational leadership at the University of Missouri.
Prior to moving into higher education, he was a math teacher and basketball coach in Missouri. Todd then served as a principal at the middle school, junior high, and high school levels. One of the world's leading authorities on staff motivation, teacher leadership, and principal effectiveness, Todd has written more than 60 books.
Website: toddwhitaker.com
X/Twitter: @ToddWhitaker
Instagram: @toddwhitaker1
About Lainie:
Lainie Rowell is a bestselling author, award-winning educator, and TEDx speaker. She is dedicated to human flourishing, focusing on community building, social-emotional learning, and honoring what makes each of us unique and dynamic through learner-driven design. She earned her degree in psychology and went on to earn both a post-graduate credential and a master's degree in education. An international keynote speaker, Lainie has presented in 41 states as well as in dozens of countries across 4 continents. As a consultant, Lainie’s client list ranges from Fortune 100 companies like Apple and Google to school districts and independent schools. Learn more at linktr.ee/lainierowell.
Website - LainieRowell.com
Twitter - @LainieRowell
Instagram - @LainieRowell
Evolving with Gratitude, the book is available here! And now, Bold Gratitude: The Journal Designed for You and by You is available too!
Both Evolving with Gratitude & Bold Gratitude have generous bulk pricing for purchasing 10+ copies delivered to the same location.🙌
Just fill out the forms linked above and someone will get back to you ASAP!
Transcript:
Lainie Rowell: [00:00:00] Okay, friends, I have a delightful, esteemed guest with us today, and so I want to welcome Dr. Todd Whitaker. Thank you for being here, Todd.
Todd Whitaker: I was looking around for the delightful esteemed guest. I thought somebody was coming on. I thought it was going to be Travis Kelsey and Taylor Swift.
I was stoked.
Lainie Rowell: Oh my goodness. You have no idea. My 12 year old daughter is a full time Swifty and there is a lot of Travis Kelsey, Taylor Swift talk in this house.
Todd Whitaker: It gets out every once in a while. You know, I always think it's weird when people slam celebrities because it isn't like, you know 'em, and I, have come to the conclusion that the women who slammed the relationship are sad they missed out on Travis and the men who slammed the relationship are sad they missed out on Taylor. And I had, I said that to a guy the other day and he goes, she's not that good looking.
And I go, have you seen a mirror? So anyhow, I'm, I don't root against people. So I'm hoping whatever's best for the world happens.
Lainie Rowell: I'm very hopeful that they find happiness in whatever relationship it is, and I am a fan of love, so whatever is meant to be, should be, right?
Todd Whitaker: Right, exactly, exactly. So that's kind of fun, though.
And my son's met Taylor Swift.
Lainie Rowell: Oh, that's cool. At a concert or some other...
Todd Whitaker: No, he was in New York and he was at the New York Film Festival and the theaters in New York of course don't have like celebrity restrooms. They have restrooms. Yeah. And he was coming out of the men's and she was coming out of the women's and he goes, they talked for quite a while.
He goes, she could not have been nicer. I don't know that he's knows her music, but he thought, he just thought she could not have been a nicer person. He said she was unbelievably normal.
Lainie Rowell: Oh, that's good. I'm a fan too, not to the level of my 12 year old daughter. I'm not planning on going to the movie so many times I can wallpaper my room in her eight and a half by 11 poster, but I am a fan of the music. And I'm really happy that she's got someone to look up to that seems so lovely.
Todd Whitaker: Yes, well us talking about them probably has dated the podcast for any future viewers, unless it ends up being a lifelong love. Then...
Lainie Rowell: I was just going to say we need some endurance. There needs to be some staying power in this romance, or we are going to have some real problems with this episode.
Well, I find it highly unlikely that people in education would not know who you are. But I'm going to go ahead and do a quick little bio and then Todd, I will ask you to jump in with more.
Dr. Todd Whitaker is a leading education presenter worldwide. He is a professor at University of Missouri, and he is also experienced as a math teacher, basketball coach in Missouri. He's been a principal. He has so much knowledge and wisdom to share for staff motivation, teacher leadership, and he's authored over 60 books. This is a astounding to me over 60 books, including What Great Teachers Do Differently, What Great Principals Do Differently. I obviously can't even get anywhere near listing even the most recent ones because there's probably been one that was published while we've been talking.
But I would love for you to share a little bit more about who you are, just so people can get to know you.
Todd Whitaker: Sure. Well, I'm have the good fortune of working in education and working with educators, and I also work with businesses and stuff, but that's peripheral of my heart, and so for education, I always say I've written 60 books, and probably one or two of them are decent, and the rest you never know, but it's really funny, and if you hear me speak or know anything, my books are all the same thing but what they really are is how do you get people to do what it is you want 'em to do. And if you think about it, the great teachers can get the students to do anything and the ineffective teachers can't get the students to do anything.
And the great principals can get their teachers to do anything. And the ineffective principals can't get the teachers to do anything. And it isn't power 'cause we don't have any power. But if you're good, you have influence. And every time you use power, you lose power, and every time you use influence you gain it, if you do it correctly.
And so, that's kind of the core of what I do, and I say this sincerely, I go, I, I talk about life, I just pretend , it's education. You know, I just pretend it in terms of that.
Lainie Rowell: That's so profound to me because I do think that there is so much of what great educators do that it's just about being great humans, right?
Todd Whitaker: We're considering writing a book called What Great Parents Do Differently. And I've mentioned a couple of times and people have come up and asked about it. And I said, I wrote it. I just included teachers in the title, but it's the same. Everything is the same skill set.
It's funny. I wrote What Great Teachers Do Differently, What Great Principals Do differently. And one time somebody came up and goes, there's a lot of overlap. And I said, I'm hoping it'd be scary if it wasn't. And because it's the same thing, the reason we have average principals is because an average superintendent hired an average teacher to become an average principal.
The great teachers would never be an average principal. They wouldn't settle for that and that doesn't mean day one they feel like they have it all down, but instead what happens is there's a certain belief system about what's right or wrong. You know, it's funny. I just worked with a group this morning and I asked them when we went virtual, you know, almost every place kind of in the world went virtual overnight in education and it was hard.
Because we didn't have a dress rehearsal, we just had opening night. You know, we didn't get to practice it. But I ask every group, I go, how many of you could, with no practice, we're all in the same boat. How many of you could name three teachers when you went virtual overnight? How many of you could name three teachers you knew were going to figure it out?
Every hand goes up. How many of you could name three teachers you knew were never going to figure it out? And how many of you could name three teachers that now we've come back in person realize the ones that couldn't figure out virtual haven't figured out in person either because it's the same thing. And that's the thing why as leaders, we have to understand the importance of our high achievers because our high achievers are the only ones that are going to move our schools forward.
And if we don't understand our high achievers. Even during a poor economy, they always can do something else. There's nothing they can't do. Your best teacher could run the best McDonald's in your town. Your best teacher could be the best realtor in the town. And what happens is now, because jobs are so frequent, even the ineffective people can get jobs.
But if you don't understand how to lead high achievers, it's such a disadvantage and it's really damaging to whatever it is. I talk to businesses about this too. You know that your best people are truly incredible people, they're gifted people, and you've got to understand where they come from, and how to lead them successfully.
Lainie Rowell: Yeah, I hear it. And you can correct me if I'm wrong on this, but one of the things that I love about your work is, and I've heard you say this, the willingness to accept responsibility makes all the difference. And I hear that in what you're talking about here, right? A great teacher would never accept being a mediocre principal because they accept so much responsibility for how they perform. They don't blame circumstance or other people. They say, well, this is what I'm going to do because I'm responsible to make this happen.
Todd Whitaker: Right. Well, ineffective people hope it's something besides them that causes them to be ineffective. You know, it's funny, one of the things I talk about, I work with professional sports coaches, like coaches that coach teams around, which is funny because I'm just a hillbilly, but I do, but I work with them on how do you get the players to try harder?
And it's funny because one of the things that has come up a couple of times, and you hear this all the time, is participation trophies. And I'll say, the coach goes, I can't make it with the players. And I go, why? And they go, because they've all gotten participation trophies. And I go, what? How many of you hear this all the time?
You know, this is a problem. This is the bane of the Western world participation trophies. And he goes, yeah, I can't motivate him because when we were little, we had to earn everything. And I said, I know what you mean. I go, when I was 2, I, I couldn't have supper till I mowed the neighbor's lawn.
And that's how I got the nickname No Toast Todd. But anyhow, it's, it, it isn't like that. And a couple of famous coaches I work with brought it up and I said, do you know who else got participation trophies? He said, who? I said, the team that beat you. And you know who else got them? The team you're playing Saturday night.
Are you looking for excuses or solutions? Effective teachers never talk about participation trophies, or whatever the world's version of participation trophies is. And ineffective people always talk about them, and hang around other people who also talk about it. Because do you see how, if you're ineffective, you hope it's participation trophies.
I had a, a parent, I was talking to two parents, they were together. And they go, boy, our kids sure misbehave, and the problem is participation trophies. And I literally was like, I don't know, I'd start with a mirror if I were you, but you do what you want, you know, it's, but effective people don't want to give away that influence.
I don't want it to be, I want it to be me. And if you are in a school or familiar with the school, and you could predict which teacher will send the most kids to the office in the 2028, 2029 school year. Which everyone can. Obviously it's not based on the number of kids with participation trophies in that classroom, it's based on the one adult that's in that classroom.
And when we realize it, it actually is very empowering for us. It truly is. The world hasn't gone bad, we just have to think in a certain way and we can be successful. That's my opinion.
Lainie Rowell: I 100 percent agree. One of the things that I remind myself and share with others is I believe the best way to change someone else's behavior is to change our own behavior first.
And this is not to be manipulative. This is just, I have the power to do this. This is what I can control. These are the things that I'm going to do. I'm going to take responsibility for what I can accomplish.
Todd Whitaker: We never can change children's behavior until we change adults behavior.
Lainie Rowell: Thousand percent.
Todd Whitaker: You know, and the one person that you can most have the ability to influence is yourself. Right. And that's just, and this isn't any innovative anything. This has just always been true. It's always going to be true. And we get lost and people lead us down other paths that sometimes can become confusing to find your way back out.
Lainie Rowell: I do want to make sure and get in the gratitude connection to your work. And so I probably won't do this gracefully. Segues are not my strong suit yet.
Todd Whitaker: Unless you need to ride them around town. Oh, that's a different segue. Anyhow, nevermind.
Lainie Rowell: That's true. That's true. So I would just love to hear from you, you know, how have you seen maybe gratitude play into your work on culture or relationships, and like you said, if we're talking about the relationship between the teacher and the student, it's also going to be the same for the teacher and the principal, and it's just really about a relationship, right, we can keep throwing labels on it, parents, teacher, whatever, but it's still the relationship.
Todd Whitaker: Well, one of the things I think that actually we've gotten lost in in education, and, and, The pandemic actually, I think, made it worse. I hear people, and when talking about schools, they're going, the key is relationships, relationships, relationships. And I truly don't believe it. I think the key is a learning relationship.
You know. I'm really good at dinner parties. I really am. I can glad hand anybody. If you want to have a dinner party and you'd like it to be good, invite Todd Whitaker. I am not kidding. It'll be the funnest, except for the grammar. It'll be the funnest dinner party you've ever had in your life. Now my act gets old after 90 minutes, but for that first 90 minutes, it's a dream.
However, it's a school year. It's not a dinner party. And if we don't make connections with the kids on a learning level, we can't be successful for nine months. And that is the relationship, that is the, a foundation of the relationship. And, and what happens is somehow or another we've got into this relationships, relationships, relationships.
And, and I believe that, but that's.
Lainie Rowell: It's like insufficient, right?
Todd Whitaker: You know, you can ask a kid about their puppy, but at some point it becomes a dog. One, one question I ask people all the time. Let's say you get to choose your child's teacher for next year, but only by description. And you can either choose a teacher that every day has engaging lessons.
Or choose a teacher that comes to your son's basketball game once a month. What's interesting is we all want the teacher that has engaging lessons. The thing to realize is, if the teacher doesn't have engaging lessons, the kid doesn't even want the teacher to come to the basketball games. And if the teacher has engaging lessons, the parents don't care if the teacher comes to basketball games.
And I'm a basketball coach. I love them coming. But it's deeper than that. And I think that's part of this. For me, gratitude, is the fact I get to combine my passion and my profession. That's the blessing. I love education. I care about education. I think it is so significant. And I'm writing a book called how to get all teachers to be like the best teachers.
Cause in my mind, that's the only solution to education. Cause in every school, we have at least one teacher that's cracked the Da Vinci code. You know, we don't need to innovate. We need to replicate. We've solved it. We have solved it. We just haven't figured out the way to replicate our very best people.
In a large enough level that all the students can be blessed by having people like that that they interact with. That's the foundation of everything I try to do is I try to help everybody become exceptional. And I think we can do it by just teaching them the way exceptional people think.
And once you realize how exceptional people think, now it's up to you if you want to think like that or not.
Lainie Rowell: Yeah, is it fair to say that The excellence that gets replicated doesn't necessarily need to be identical. Because I hear you saying like the way they think and it's not that you'd walk into teacher A's room and teacher B's room and they're doing exactly the same thing in the exact same way, right?
Todd Whitaker: Great people have identical end goals. They just have different pathways to get there. They want to be exceptional for every student, they just have different pathways to do it. And that's what happens whenever we focus on programs instead of people. I was just working with a group and they had talked about their district was going to go to flexible seating in classrooms and they were going to mandate it.
And I said mandate and flexible somehow doesn't seem parallel, but whatever. But we can all name highly effective teachers that would be highly effective with flexible seating. We can all name highly effective teachers that would be highly effective without flexible seating. We can all name ineffective teachers that would be ineffective with flexible seating.
And we can all name ineffective teachers that would be ineffective without flexible seating. Immediately we know the variable is not flexible seating.
I say, have you ever been in a poor lecturer's classroom, and everybody raises their hand, and I say, when, when I say poor lecturer's classroom, which of those three words is the problem, and I'm going to eliminate the word classroom, and the group always thinks the problem's lecture, the problem's poor.
Why would I take away lecture from the best teacher in my school if that's something that they find truly engaging and exceptional? But why would I mandate lecture with someone that has better strengths and other strengths than lecture? I'm not a proponent of flexible seating and I'm not an opponent, but if I have a teacher that's juiced up about flexible seating, why on earth as a principal, don't I do everything in my power to support them?
Cause if they're more excited about teaching, then the kids are more excited about learning, but I'm never going to jam down the throat of a highly effective teacher, flexible seating, because if they're less excited about teaching, then the kids are less excited about learning. It isn't identical, but if you think of classroom management, classroom management is selfish. If any of us could get the students to behave better, we'd get the students to behave better. If you have children, if you could get your own children to behave better, you'd get your children to behave better because it benefits your favorite person in the family, you.
But what happens is when people struggle with classroom management, it's not effort. It's not effort and interest. It's knowledge. They don't know how to do it. And once you teach people how to do it, you'd be stunned how they'll do it. But what happens is if we have leaders that don't know how to teach them, then the people have to figure it out on their own.
And the people that can figure it out on their own have already figured it out on their own. So I think there are core beliefs like things like. You're the filter. You're in charge of what comes out of your mouth and what doesn't. And once you're aware of that, it's like, do you, do you know anybody that if you see them and you say, how was your weekend?
You know, they're always going to say something negative, not because anything happened because they always say something negative, but it's teaching people what happens when you're like that. It's like teaching people... I'm not a false positive guy at all, but one of the things I teach people is one of the most powerful things you can do is use well placed compliments.
And the reason people that do that stand out, because people don't get complimented. They don't feel important. They don't feel valued. And people get jealous of people that get complimented, only if they don't feel valued themselves. But if you feel valued yourself, you're happy. Here's an example of something.
The great people see the world as an unlimited sum game, which means everyone can be successful. Average people see the world as a limited sum game. Which means only some people can be successful and that's where jealousy comes in because if it's a limited sum game and then you get some Lainie, that means there's less for me If it's an unlimited sum game, I can celebrate you and I can still be successful And I think if there's certain things related to. One of the things too is even for teachers to stuff like 10 days out Of 10 all the great teachers treat students with respect and dignity every single day I guess you could think different people do it in different ways, but all great people do it.
They, they don't treat the kids with respect four days out of five. They don't do that. They do it 10 days out of 10.
Lainie Rowell: Yes, what's one message you would like to give educators listening.
Todd Whitaker: The thing I'd like to share with educators is thank you. Thank you for choosing a profession that makes a difference in people's lives every day, because I have to be honest, and people are listening may not like it, most professions don't matter. They really don't matter. You know, you go to a Walmart and the clerk's surly, but you still go back because their prices are good, and now because the clerk's surly, they put in a self check and you can always shoplift.
But what happens is, in education, what we do is way too important. It is way too significant. And, and one of the tough things is, educators have to also work on reminding themselves this. But I think that's one of the reasons for the demonization of teachers, is I think they're jealous of teachers, because now you're with somebody whose job actually matters, and you know it.
You know, you could name your first grade teacher, you could name your fourth grade teacher, you could name your high school sophomore teacher, you could name your last math teacher you have, you could potentially name the custodian, you could name a bus driver, depending on where you went to school, but in other professions, it isn't that significant, and I, I really think that, and, and that's hard, you know, the best thing about teaching is it matters, the hardest thing about teaching is it matters every day.
But that's why teachers need breaks. They need a chance to recharge. They need summers. They need a chance to recoup. They need professional development that would help them reset the way they think. I really believe everybody got an education for the right reasons. I think somehow we just get lost in our way a little bit.
You know, we get tired, we get worn out. We are surrounded by two other colleagues at our grade level who tend to bring us down. And that's hard, but I just want to thank teachers for what they do, and the pandemic proved it more than anything else. Because it wasn't students just following behind academically, they also fell behind behaviorally and socially, which tells you we have to have our schools.
We have to do it. It's funny. If I ever hear a person say, anyone can teach, I always tell them, you got your crack during the pandemic. How'd that work for you, genius boy? You know, your kid left school and he was struggling. You brought him back after six months with you and he was valedictorian. You know, that's not the way it works.
And our job as educators is to cultivate society, not reflect society. And sometimes it's hard to remember that, because there's people who are fighting against that, but , we have to have new and better people, or we'll never have a new and better place to be, place to live, and that really, education is such a core of that, and that's not taking away the importance of parents, of course not, but education is, is a real core of that.
Lainie Rowell: I appreciate you being such an advocate for whatever role educators are playing, I feel like you really advocate for them. And. really highlighting what's effective and then here's how we can all get there is such an important piece of the work that you do.
Todd Whitaker: Well, my real core bailiwick, to be honest, is leaders in any purpose. Everything's a leader. Whatever happens is due to the leader. Everything good's the leader, everything bad's the leader. And I always say it's a lot easier to criticize the leader than it is to be one. And and I think that in education, leaders have done so much to help others.
But we have a lot of things that people repeat and they're just wrong. But it's because you've heard average people repeat them, so you repeat them. It's like the people that say the problem's lecture, and I go, you ever had a great lecture? And they go, yes. I go, apparently the problem isn't lecture.
The problem is poor. But see, what happens is they don't reflect in that way. And I think that it's, it's understanding the role of what the leader does. Like I saw a thing the other day that said leaders should hire good people and get out of their way. Can I tell you a secret? Good people don't want the leaders out of their way.
You want them paving the way. You want them supporting the way. You want them guarding the way. You want them stroking the way, valuing the way, making you feel significant, making you feel important. It's only if a leader's no good, do you want the leader out of the way.
It's interesting, in any profession, leaders hang around with people who have about the same skill set they have. Exceptional leaders hang around exceptional teachers or exceptional employees because you both think alike.
Average leaders hang around average teachers or average employees because you both think alike. Ineffective leaders hang around ineffective employees because you both think alike. And it makes you feel very comfortable. And that's the same way with your peers at work, so often that's also part of it.
You hang around with people that have about the same skill set because many times people are looking for the same excuse set. And you can reinforce each other.
Lainie Rowell: I'm reflecting on something you said earlier, which I loved how you were talking about the oxymoron of mandatory and flexible when it came to the seating, right?
In that situation, what I'm hearing is it's a poor leader that would say, We're going to make everyone do this. So in that case, you do actually want that leader out of the way. Don't do that to me, right?
Todd Whitaker: Because it's a poor leader. Yes. Right.
Lainie Rowell: And if it was a strong leader, I don't want to stand in the way of the teacher who's passionate about this.
I do want to give opportunities for this to replicate where it will be successful, but I'm not going to say everyone needs to institute mandatory flexible seating.
Todd Whitaker: No, no. Realize also, though, as leaders, the highly effective leaders also protect highly effective people from negative peers. I used to always tell my teachers this, and this will probably sound so ridiculous, I used to tell my teachers this, how about we make a deal?
You take care of the students, I'll take care of the adults. They would buy that up for one second. I will take care of challenging adults, and I'll protect you, and I'll defend you, and I'll work with you. I'll take care of, you know, it's so weird. Weaker leaders tell people, if you have a bully colleague, you need to stand up to the bully.
And I go, no, that's my job. That's not your job. Do you have children?
Lainie Rowell: I do. I have two.
Todd Whitaker: Do you expect your children to fix their friends?
Lainie Rowell: No,
Todd Whitaker: Do you expect your children to do what's right even when their friends do wrong?
Lainie Rowell: It is a constant conversation we have.
Todd Whitaker: And that's what I feel like with my teachers I need my teachers to do rights when their colleagues do wrong.
I'll take care of the wrong I just need you to do right And I think that's a that's a lot to ask but I think that's fair to ask the same way with your own children. You need them to do right even if their friends do wrong That's a lot to ask, but I think that's very fair to ask.
Lainie Rowell: When you're giving the permission, you're saying, I'm here to support you.
It would be like if I said to my kids, well, don't do what they do, and I'm not gonna help you with that. Like, hey, if you need me to be the bad guy, call me. Text me this word, say, Taylor Swift. That'll be our code word, we're making that the theme for this episode. Text me the two words, Taylor Swift, and I will call you and demand that you come home right now and I will be the bad guy because you're not going to change them. Hopefully you influence them in a positive way, but you're not going to necessarily change them. So I will be the bad guy I will support you. I will take you out of that situation.
Todd Whitaker: We're all 13 years old And we still operate, no matter how old we are, as 13 year olds. And once we understand that, it's amazing how easy it is to lead people and make them feel important. You know, I just I tweeted something the other day that said, In the history of calm down, no one's ever calmed down by being told to calm down.
And really, probably at the core of my leadership belief is you can't mandate effectiveness. But you can teach it. And if you teach it, people will do it. Because everybody wants to be good. They want to be good. The first thing we have to sort out with people that aren't being effective is are they ignorant or insubordinate?
And we almost always think they're insubordinate and they're almost always ignorant and ignorant doesn't mean unintelligent, ignorant means unaware of how to do it right. And that's how come, I always go back to classroom management. I do so much more than classroom management, but I go back to classroom management because it truly is selfish.
And if I have a teacher doing it ineffectively, they're the ones that get the burden of it. They're the ones that are the most miserable. And once I, but I can't tell you to manage your class because you're already doing the best you know how. But if I teach you to manage your class, literally specific, my books are specific, but it's only because I've never read them, but people say they're specific because I want you to know how to do it.
I don't want anyone to call a parent if you don't know what to say when you call parents, because if it goes wrong, you lose your confidence. And confidence is the most valuable gift a leader can give their people, and when you think about schools, confidence is the most valuable gift that teachers can give their students.
And part of confidence is knowledge.
You know, I'd ask a lot more girls out when I was younger if I knew what to say. Because they knew what to say, no, but I didn't know what to say. But if I'd have known what to say, I would have said it. You know, the knowledge of how to do that, then I would say it. And that's part of what gratitude is, is being able to teach people how to be effective, being able to teach people because.
They're also going to share that gift with others too.
Lainie Rowell: This has given me so much to think on. One of the greatest joys about doing a podcast is going back and listening to it while I'm checking the sound and taking out the silly things that I say. But I'm really, really grateful for this time that I had with you.
Do you have any more shout outs to give? You've already done so much to thank teachers, leaders, whatever their role are.
Todd Whitaker: No, it isn't shout outs. My, one thing I tell people all the time when I present and, and write and meet them. My website's ToddWhitaker.com and I don't have any people. And on Twitter, or I guess that's old school, X I'm @ToddWhitaker if anybody ever wants to visit. It's really interesting. Teaching is the most isolated profession and you're never alone. Leading can be the most isolated profession and you're never alone. But as long as you're on the side of the kids, I'm on your side.
And sometimes that neutral outsider's opinion... I used to teach my teachers this. You can ask me anything you want, I'll tell you the truth, and I won't hurt your feelings. And that really is a confidence way for people because when somebody calls me as long as they're on the students I'm on the side of them and I just want to help people I what you do is so important. What we do is so important.
I don't want you to feel alone while you're doing it And I just thank the teachers for doing that I think educators for doing this and I think businesses who have made that leap to try to train their employees and schools are Special places. And every once in a while you go in a business where you're surprised that someone made eye contact, asked for your help, thanked you for being in there, and was gracious.
And one of the reasons they may have done that is because they had a teacher who taught them how to do that. So but the other thing is just thank you for inviting me. What you do makes a bigger difference than what I do. Your audience is... Very widely thought of, you're highly thought of, and I'm just glad to be a, a tiny little piece on that.
And usually after people record me on podcasts, they don't actually air it anyhow, so there's a chance that nobody will hear this. So we'll just see.
Lainie Rowell: That is ridiculous. No, no, no, no. I could never keep this wisdom bottled up, and I really appreciate your time. You have been so gracious you're very humble.
Your, your work is profoundly impactful, and I just want to say some of the things that I appreciate about what you share. Yes, it's specific, it's actionable, you also have an economy of words, like you get to the point so swiftly in a way that's easier for people like me to process, and I really appreciate that.
Todd Whitaker: My first book was dealing with difficult teachers, believe it or not, and think of gratitude.
And it's because I was a middle school principal and you can't hide a crummy teacher in a middle school because every day the kids are on the hunt for weakness, you know what I mean, every day. But one of my standards is you have to treat ineffective people as if everyone else was watching. Because they want you to deal with them.
They just want you to deal with them in a professional, respectful manner. And once we understand that, because then I'm not worried, let's pretend it was you and I were having a private conversation, Lainie, and I was trying to do something to help you improve. Well, as long as I treat you like everybody was watching, I don't care if you go out and tell people what I did.
Because the good people like it, and the bad people are thinking there's a chance of their next. And it's just teaching them this, and so, that's kind of the part of that and it really is a universal world. It, it, it, it, everything applies everywhere. The, the, the same things apply everywhere. We just get confused and think they don't.
And it isn't people, and it's so funny when people go, Teachers aren't good because they have. Because they have tenure because of unions. And I go, have you ever been in a fast food restaurant? Are those people just knocking it out of the park all the time? You know what I mean? They don't have tenure.
They don't have unions. It's, it's just people, people are people. And that's always going to be that way, but it's always leadership that determines if this helps move forward or if this allows things to deteriorate. It's always leadership.
Lainie Rowell: I just, I really appreciate your emphasis on accountability.
And the way that you present with such honor and respect for humans, we'll just like go that broad, is, is really, really empowering to me, and I know that to others too, so I thank you for sharing all of this wisdom. I know you mentioned earlier ToddWhitaker.com is the best place to connect with you, is that fair to say?
Todd Whitaker: Yes. And on Twitter, it's just at Todd Whitaker.
Lainie Rowell: I will make sure to put it in the show notes so people can just touch on it.
And yes, you've been really accessible to me and to others. And I appreciate everything you put out there. So friends, you need to be not only listening to this podcast episode, which you've done now, you need to go and check out his website where he is very generous with their samples of him speaking.
And there's just so much great content on his website. And then there's also, you know. what he's posting on Twitter and I follow you on Instagram too. You're in both, right?
Todd Whitaker: Yes, and you can tell I do a terrible job at Instagram. I never make stories. I just post one thing and I just go on and, and post myself and one of my daughters running twice a week.
Lainie Rowell: I am very excited to get this episode out and very, very much thank you and appreciate this time. Thank you for being so generous, Todd.
Todd Whitaker: It's a blessing and an honor for me. I, I thank you and thank you everyone out there for what you do every day to make a difference.
It's incredible, the impact you have. And I think it goes so far beyond what people know.
Lainie Rowell: You're so kind. Thank you all for listening.